These conflicting views on Saul would continue long past the biblical era and into modern times. God would have said, "Kill them all!" If we think that we have it all figured out, I am sorry, we do not. It is his sin. What have they done? He became jealous and he went wacko, basically. So, he spared Agag, and he spared a lot of the good stuff. He had to sit there and judge people with all the little things they constantly brought up to him that seemed to need his decision on. There should have been payment for it. However, that is not the case. He was not thinking spiritually. It only says that God heeded the prayer of the land. And the king said, "I will give them." If you read Psalm 51 it is very clear that he understood his own makeup. In fact, it can be read as if David approached it as only a minor administrative matter. A brief, but important, reference to the Gibeonites can also be found in 2 Samuel 21:1-14. Later, during a wasting famine, David, attempting a political rather than a righteous solution, yielded to the Gibeonites' request that descendants of Saul be hanged to avenge the slaughter. It does not seem to me that during this time of the three years of famine David was emulating the attitude that he wrote about in Psalm 34. It looks to me like he tried to work out a political solution rather than a righteous one. Deuteronomy 32:4. Instead, David brings back twice as many. Deuteronomy 19:7-10 Therefore I command you, saying, 'You shall separate three cities for yourself.' This is certainly not the David of Psalm 34, where he wrote. And if He sinned, then He could not be our Savior. For many today, this time period is ancient history. So he brought up the bones of Saul and the bones of Jonathan his son from there; and they gathered the bones of those who had been hanged. They looked to Him and were radiant, and their faces were not ashamed. Saul tried to get back his throne from God by doing what he thought was right, what he thought was zealous for God, by getting rid of the foreignersincluding the Gibeonitesthat were among them. So the famine continued for another half a year. (Now the Gibeonites were not Israelites, but a remnant of the Amorites. God punished the whole nation for breaking the covenant. Oh, taste and see that the LORD is good; blessed is the man who trusts in Him! And that day Joshua made them woodcutters and water carriers for the congregation and for the altar of the LORD, in the place which He would choose, even to this day. He keeps his word even to his own disadvantage and does not change it [for his own benefit] (Psalm 15:1, 4; AMP). This is interesting. Back in I Samuel 15, Saul was told by God through Samuel to go up against the Amalekites, and to destroy everything in sight, do not spare anything; exterminate them. He is beyond us; it does not make any sense. Why were genealogies so important to Israel? The angel of the LORD encamps all around those who fear Him, and delivers them. I dont think it was a matter of God allowing the Gibeonites to put to death Sauls sons. Some interesting similarities to New Testament times occur to me: The fact that David made a covenant with Jonathan regarding Jonathans house (1 Sam 20:14-16), would take precedence over all other reasons not to give up Mephibosheth, I would suppose. They are going to cause problems. It is the time of the beginning of the barley harvest. And that is why God heeded the prayer of the land. So this zeal may not have carried good connotations (cf John 2:17) it was not zeal for God but zeal for man, an ongoing problem with Saul. Perhaps he thought, "Hmm. He has mercy, and holds the curses to just a few generations, but He allows the results of doing righteousness to last forever. Now if the LORD your God enlarges your territory, as He swore to your fathers, and gives you the land which He promised to give to your fathers, and if you keep all these commandments and do them, which I command you today, to love the LORD your God and to walk always in His ways, then you shall add three more cities for yourself besides these three, lest innocent blood be shed in the midst of your land which the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, and thus guilt of bloodshed be upon you. but Saul had sought to kill them in his zeal for the children of Israel and Judah. However, there was a difference between Israel's version and the Gentiles' principle of vengeance or retribution. They were the five sons of Merab, Saul's daughter. That is that he could have gone along with the Gibeonite's demands in order to get rid of seven possible contenders for his throne. God says very clearly that Israel was to conquer them, destroy them, and make no covenant with them. It has got to go. Share Verse 1 did say that it was "Saul and his bloodthirsty house" who had massacred the Gibeonites. Christ says, Luke 21:34-35 "But take heed to yourselves, lest your hearts be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness, and cares of this life, and that Day come on you unexpectedly. When God called Saul to be king, Israel was on the verge of collapse. During the time of the judges, the Israelites had repeatedly turned away, lea The famine was a punishment for Sauls violation of the covenant, made with the Gibeonites back during the days of Joshua. Other Translations for 2 Samuel 21:1 Discussion for 2 Samuel 21 View All We are starting to get some of the atmosphere around this event now. Saul had four sons. * Jonathanhe befriended David, died with Saul on Mount Gilboa * Abinadabdied with Saul on Mount Gilboa * Malchishuadied with If the Gibeonites brought guile and deceit into the land; it was Saul who set the example for deep and devastating This angered God and was only amended years later after sacrificing seven of Sauls sons to the Gibeonites by hanging them before Jehovah at Sauls hometown, Gibeah. After that, Gibeonites were no longer mentioned though there are some writers who believed that they were among the Nethinim, the ones selected to serve the temple. With a careful reading and a bit of thought, you will begin to raise some questions. WebThe Gibeonite Deception - Now when all the kings west of the Jordan heard about these thingsthe kings in the hill country, in the western foothills, and along the entire coast of the Mediterranean Sea as far as Lebanon (the kings of the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites) they came together to wage war against Joshua and That is basically how it was. What I am trying to show you by going through these different places is that there is plenty of law that King David could have looked back on. Here are guidelines to help facilitate a meaningful learning experience for everyone. When asked about the time of the end; when questioned about the signs that would precede His Second Coming, our blessed Lord instinctively cautioned: "Take heed that no man deceive you." Joshua 9:22-24 Then Joshua called for them, and he spoke to them, saying, "Why have you deceived us, saying, 'We are very far from you,' when you dwell near us? Notice the timing and the manner of the execution. The Israelites had promised not to Joshua 9:14-16 Then the men of Israel took some of their provisions; but they did not ask counsel of the LORD. Then there are things of degeneracy. This is pretty clear. And the LORD answered, It is because of Saul and his bloodthirsty house, At the time the Israelites under Joshua invaded the Promised Land of Canaan, most of the inhabitants rose up in arms against them. How much food did Jesus produce? Deep and long lasting trouble for both parties - both the Israelites and the Gibeonites - was the fruit of this clever, but calamitous deception. But certainly, David was. You had only black and white television if you had television. Once again, God's anointed was compelled to humble himself and his nation before a delegation of these servile Gibeonites. The Bible doesnt really say. This is taken from the book Antiquities of the Jews, pg. 7: AFTER this, when the country was greatly afflicted with a Davids choice of victims reflects at least the covenant between him and Jonathan, if not also the one between him This is a major reason why the church of God does not subscribe to the traditional doctrine of "The Fall of Man." They knew all the things God had stipulated about what they were to do when Israel was going to come into the land. If what happened against Gibeon occurred during Saul's reign, even if it was in the latter half, it would mean it was at least (if we are in the last decade of King David's reign) that the massacre of Gibeonites occurred 40 or 50 years earlier. This shows that this portion of the story in II Samuel 21, hanging the bodies for six months or so, was an additional curse upon the land. Joshua kept his word to the Gibeonites even when it was inconvenient. We want them to reflect what a real person would do in extreme or extraordinary circumstances. King David is mentioned by name as a hero of faith. King Saul exhibited that hubris, that overweening pride in his own decisions and that unfounded confidence in his own good judgment that he brought certain and lasting disaster upon his own dynasty. He was tired of life, tired of war, tired of all the politics, tired of all the rebellion, tired of Joab. The Rock, his work is perfect, for all his ways are justice. Therefore David said to the Gibeonites, "What shall I do for you? Now it came to pass, when Adonizedec king of They were a group of Amorites. The verb is used in this sense with respect to Joshua's action toward the Gibeonites in Joshua 9:27, where cultic servitude is involved ("for the altar of the Lord"). God punished the whole nation for breaking the covenant. ( v.1 ) So God sent a famine to punish a kingdom for something that a former king supposedly did. They didn't present themselves in a truthful light saying that they were neighbors who respected Israel's strength and godly advantage and were suing for peace. So, others besides Saul were guilty. Even though the avenger of blood could kill the person if he caught him before he arrived at the city of refugewhat this verse is saying, here, is that if the nation follows through, and enlarges the lands by obeying God, He will designate more cities of refuge so that they are closer. September 01 2013 They knew! Joshua 9:25-27 "And now, here we are, in your hands; do with us as it seems good and right to do to us." Notice verse 2 says that Saul tried to strike them down in his zeal (also means jealously or envy) for the people of Israel and Judah. If, in the event the Israelis ever came their way, they would be servants to the people of Israel. There is no indication in II Samuel 21 that David got advice from any of his ministers about how to deal with this situation. Saul was thirty years old when he began to reign, and he reigned for forty -two years over Israel. Although the people of Israel had sworn to spare them, Saul had sought to strike them down in his zeal for the people of Israel and Judah. Saul and the heir to the throne, his son, Jonathan, were killed in a battle with the Philistines, and by popular acclamation, David became the King of Israel. 2 Samuel 21:2 At this, David summoned the Gibeonites and spoke to them. He will not relent. All answers are REVIEWED and MODERATED. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself. God is just. The Gibeonites left their mark on Israel's history in another wretched incident involving Why was David so loyal to Saul after everything Saul had done to him? We do not know how long before II Samuel 21 this incident happened. They agree to the death of seven of Saul's descendants. 1316). Justice seems to have been served. God sees behind the scenes. Finally, someone says to David, "Hey, did you know that Rizpah has been out on a rock for six months, sitting there day after day, protecting the corpses from birds and such, because the Gibeonites won't let her take them down and bury them? So the king took Armoni and Mephibosheth, the two sons of Rizpah the daughter of Aiah, whom she bore to Saul; and the five sons of Michal [Merabsee margin of most Bibles] the daughter of Saul, whom she brought up for Adriel the son of Barzillai the Meholathite; and he delivered them into the hands of the Gibeonites, and they hanged them on the hill before the LORD. Report This incident of the famine took place rather late in David's life. So they performed all that the king commanded. And how do I know this? Before she married David, Abigail had been the wife of _____. by LeRoy Gardenier Yet, because of the long time that has passed since then until now, when the Gibeonites were asked to bring it up, how many of the guilty ones had died? I think he was distracted by all the cares of his office of being king. It is in II Samuel 21. The chronicler, herewhoever he wasis giving us a big hint that David's attention was elsewhere for three whole years. Joshua 9:3-6 But when the inhabitants of Gibeon heard what Joshua had done to Jericho and Ai, they worked craftily [remember that], and went and pretended to be ambassadors. He just let them walk all over him. Something is wrong. He could have done several things differently, perhaps giving the Gibeonites their freedom as a way to repay them. We are getting toward the end of King David's life. Numbers 35:34 "Therefore do not defile the land which you inhabit, in the midst of which I dwell; for I the LORD dwell among the children of Israel.'". And those two are questionable. In addition, his own soldiers had to tell him, "David, you just don't have it anymore. persecuted and killed the Gibeonites men in a covenant relationship with Israel who served at the tabernacle. When the Gibeonites heard that the other nations were going to attack them, they sent a message to Joshua and the people, Help! Much later, King Saul ignored this covenant of peace and killed some Gibeonites. Jew or gentile? WebThis points to their employment in the sanctuary; and possibly may shed some light on the massacre of the Gibeonites by Saul (2 Samuel 21:1). Gibeon is only a few miles mostly north of Jerusalem. Why did he not seem to notice the first year and say to himself, "Hmm. . But, they like the dark one because he is moody, and doing things not for quite the right reasons. One of the things He specifically mentions is famine, which happens to be the third sealphysical famine, but we remember from Amos that there is a spiritual famine as well. God spared them as a people, but His nation condemned them to endless servitude. We have all followed in the same way of life as our first parents Adam and Eve. What is the meaning of the parable of the rich man and his manager? It would have been the answer. Then Ishbi-Benob, who was one of the sons of the giant, the weight of whose bronze spear was three hundred shekels, who was bearing a new sword, thought he could kill David. Joshua kept his word to the Gibeonites even when it was inconvenient. But what actually did Saul do to the Gibeonites? Oh, fear the LORD, you His saints! And, that was that. I want you to understand where Barry was coming from in writing the note. There was a covenant with those people that not only Joshua and the people honored, but also God Himself honored as well. Then there is another thing. Such a shame to destroy it all! Then they asked for a king, and God gave them Saul son of Kish, a man of the tribe of Benjamin, for forty years. Some unfinished business here needs to be taken care of. I also want you to see how warlike Saul was. Also David seems to have only spared Mephibosheth only because he made an oath, and not for the fact that he was only five years old and did not participate in killing the Gibeonites? How did the spirit of God move upon the face of the waters in Genesis 1:2? When were threatened by a Philistine attack, Saul he disobeyed Jehovah by offering a sacrifice instead of waiting for Samuel to do it. We have examples of where that has happened, but he did not do that this time. Then, pray for all you are worth so that your relationship with God and Jesus Christ is strong when the famine hits. It is not pretty when we allow the people of the land to dictate to us. Vote Up 0 responses 4. They do what their flesh tells them to dowhat Satan inspires them to want to doand they do it. It provides the cities of refuge where he could go serve a type of prison sentenceif it was an accidental murderuntil the high priest died. Perhaps if I go and kill all the Gibeonites like Joshua was supposed to do, maybe God will let me back into the chair.". When this righteous ruler turned to God, the Lord showed him that arrogant error of his predecessor. Perhaps trickery will be better than war for us.". Their representatives were not up front with the Israeli leaders. Then, I am sure, he started to think about other things that were happening, and he started to make some reforms in himself. He went after a people that God did not want exterminated anymore. 2. If the Gibeonites brought guile and deceit into the land; it was Saul who set the example for deep and devastating delusion. 1 Now there was a famine in the days of David for three years, year after year. He keeps his word even to his own disadvantage and does not change it [for his own benefit] (Psalm 15:1, 4; AMP). According to a May 2007 George Barna Poll, 63% of Americans, mostly professing Christians, believe that Jesus sinned during His physical life! Go coach! He was endangering the whole army by being out there, an old man trying to fight like a young man. It is not the sin of Adam and Eve; it is their own sin. The Bible helps us in this way, because it is full of examples of flawed heroes of faith. [And the answer is] Because the son has done what is lawful and right, and has kept all My statutes and observed them, he shall surely live. Ezekiel 18 makes it clear that God punishes people for their own iniquity. I am just going to start with the backdrop to the incident. I am putting this all together from history. Deceit and delusion are powerful spiritual weapons of destruction but they pale in potency compared to the creative and edifying Word of God come alive by faith in believers' hearts! The Gibeonites presented themselves to the invading Israelites, not as nearby neighbors, but as distant foreigners who lived in a far-off land. I Samuel 14:47-48 So Saul established his sovereignty over Israel, and fought against all his enemies on every side, against Moab, against the people of Ammon, against Edom, against the kings of Zobah, and against the Philistines. THE BATTLES OF THE LORD We have our own sins to pay for; we do not pay for theirs. Community answers are sorted based on votes. II Samuel 21:1-2 Now there was a famine in the days of David for three years, year after year; and David inquired of the LORD. Why so? But the massacre of the Gibeonites probably occurred after that. And Samuel says, "See? Moreover, the Gibeonites who survived remembered, and they wanted blood when they were asked. And it very seriously affected his judgment in this matter. 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